King James Bible Believers

 

 

 

Conditional Security
Scripturally 
Refuted

Part Two

By

Kevin Rae

 

 

 

 

 

Conditional Security
Scripturally 
Refuted

Part Two

 

Foreword

The Christian is sealed unto the day of redemption - Ephesians 4:30  And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. -  2 Thessalonians 2:16-17  Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace, Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.

The Christian has everlasting consolation, is sealed, has good hope and has comfort in his heart. Why any Christian can call God a liar and say that the Christian can be unsealed, how then would that bring comfort to a Christian is beyond reason. Let God be the Judge. Romans 3:4  … yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; …

 

Continuing from part one. We shall look at some other popular misapplied verses of God’s Holy Writ concerning ‘conditional security’.

Romans 11

Romans 11:19-22  Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

This is one of the main verses that the deceivers use to pull the wool over the Christian’s eyes. The deceivers put the individual Christian in the text and say he is a branch which can be cut off if he doesn’t continue in his goodness. Their other proof text for this is John 15:6 which we will look at later.

Pray - Psalms 119:18  Open thou mine eyes, that I may behold wondrous things out of thy law. Now, open the KJV1611 and read Romans chapter 11.

The whole chapter is a contrast between the blindness of the nation of Israel and the Gentile nations.  There is NO individual salvation in the WHOLE of the chapter!  Paul is trying to make his fellow Israelites envious (Romans 11:14  If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them. ) to the point that some would rather get saved than see a gentile dog get closer to God than them, Paul was egging his fellow Israelites into a decision.  In ( Rom 11:16 ) we have a Holy nation which is set apart unto God and is connected to an Olive tree, that Nation IS Israel. Notice, not all the branches are broken up, (Ro 11:17And if some of the branches be broken off… ) WHY? because many Jews believed and became Christians.  The wild olive branches are the gentile nations in the church age who believe in Jesus Christ by faith. Gentile nations are warned not to be proud ( v 20 …Be not highminded, but fear: ) and conceited (Romans 11:25  For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.) and not to turn their back on God. As a nation, if they turn their back on God, God will no longer bless that nation! (Romans 11:21  For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.) Paul warns Christian nations the world over that if they forsake God like Israel has, then God will forsake them as a Nation. God will look on that Nation like as a bunch of heathens, even though there might be Christians among them.

 The example of Romans 11 is found in Acts 28 below, where Paul has been preaching to the Israelites and they have rejected Jesus Christ again as a Nation. But individual Jews can still be saved ( Romans 11:14 ). Notice Israel’s dull of hearing and eyes closed, the same as you find it in Romans 11:7-10 . God’s salvation has turned from the Nation of Israel to the Nations of the Gentiles. ( as you find it in Romans 11 without twisting any scriptures) The branches are obviously NATIONS and NOT individuals. It is nations that get cut off! That is exactly why Christians should pray for the leaders of their Country.

 Acts 28:25-28  And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers, Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive: For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them. Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it.

As you can plainly read for yourself in the passages of scripture, your discernment will reveal the deceit of these holiness people ( well they claim to be holier than thou). To try and tell an individual Christian that he can lose his salvation by quoting Romans 11 is just a desperate tactic of devilish people. These people cannot accept that The Lord Jesus Christ has saved the sinner ALONE without the help from anyone’s works and righteousness.

John 15:1-8

The proof text that the conditional securists use to back up Romans 11 is ( John 15:6  If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. )

Firstly, the people to whom Jesus is talking to in John 15 are Jewish disciples who keep the Law of Moses, and they know nothing about the gospel of the cross of Calvary yet. Jesus is telling His disciples that they are extensions of Himself as long as they abide in Him. The disciples will do greater works than Jesus Himself ( John 14:12 ) They will be hated by their fellow Israelites ( John 16:2 ). Anything that they ask God, He will give it ( John 15:7  If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.)  [ These ‘conditional securists’  DO NOT BELIEVE that this verse applies to them, [ because if they did all they would have to do is ask the Father to open my eyes and I would be like them] even though they claim it to be doctrinally applicable to the Christian, so who is deceiving who? ]  The disciples are going to be taking the message of Jesus Christ to the Nation of Israel primarily after the Lord Jesus Christ leaves them.( Acts chapter 2 – 8 ) Also the disciples are called ‘friends’ and not ‘servants’ ( John 15:15 ). Christians are called ‘sons’ (Galatians 4:6  And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. ) The Christian is not an appendage sticking out the side of the Lord Jesus Christ like a branch out of the tree trunk. The fact is the Christian is part of the Lord Jesus’ flesh and bones (Ephesians 5:30  For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.)

Now for the passage itself.

The disciples heard firsthand the parables of the vineyard ( Luke 20:9-19, Matt 21:33-46, Mark 12:1-12 ) Please take time to read them. The disciples were bound to make the connection with the parables of the vineyard and the discourse that Jesus was telling them about Him being the true vine and the Father being the husbandman, them being servants who are now called sons. The parables told the disciples that the son of the husbandman was to be killed and the vineyard was going to a different nation (Matthew 21:43  Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. )  So, the disciples know this about the vineyard parables, and now Jesus is telling them personally that they better abide in Him and produce fruit for the husbandman who is the Father, or there will be consequences to pay. ( John 15:6 ).

The disciples knew their duty, as Peter said prior, to whom shall we go? ( John 6:68  Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.) So bearing in mind that the disciples knew the parables of the vineyard and they knew Jesus is God, and God will not fail them (Deuteronomy 31:6  Be strong and of a good courage, fear not, nor be afraid of them: for the LORD thy God, he it is that doth go with thee; he will not fail thee, nor forsake thee. ) This threat in John 15:6 is not directed to the disciples themselves, and the threat is NOT directed to Christians. So to whom is this threat made?  The threat is doctrinally to the Israelites during the time of Jacobs trouble, who must have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ AND keep his commandments (John 15:10  If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.  and  Revelation 14:12  Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.) This threat is told to Israelites before the cross of Calvary who only have the Old Testament scriptures to learn from. Let’s learn!

The true vine will take you to Deut 32:32 comparing it with the false vine, ‘their vine is of the vine of Sodom’ which then takes you to Ezekiel 15:1-8  And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Son of man, What is the vine tree more than any tree, or than a branch which is among the trees of the forest? Shall wood be taken thereof to do any work? or will men take a pin of it to hang any vessel thereon? Behold, it is cast into the fire for fuel; the fire devoureth both the ends of it, and the midst of it is burned. Is it meet for any work?  Behold, when it was whole, it was meet for no work: how much less shall it be meet yet for any work, when the fire hath devoured it, and it is burned?  Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; As the vine tree among the trees of the forest, which I have given to the fire for fuel, so will I give the inhabitants of Jerusalem. And I will set my face against them; they shall go out from one fire, and another fire shall devour them; and ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I set my face against them. And I will make the land desolate, because they have committed a trespass, saith the Lord GOD. In this passage we have the vine, branches, burned wood, men working and casting into the fire branches. A very similar passage to John 15 wouldn’t you say?  Who goes into the fire in Ezekiel? The Nation of Israel who are not working for God.

Furthermore we read in Isaiah

Isaiah 27:11  When the boughs thereof are withered, they shall be broken off: the women come, and set them on fire: for it is a people of no understanding: therefore he that made them will not have mercy on them, and he that formed them will shew them no favour.

 Ezekiel 19:12  But she was plucked up in fury, she was cast down to the ground, and the east wind dried up her fruit: her strong rods were broken and withered; the fire consumed them.

 Getting the picture now, without getting too deep into the Tribulation passages of the Old Testament, we have said enough to prove that this passage in John 15 is doctrinally for the tribulation where Israelites will have faith, and will keep the commandments, the remnant of Israel will have to flee from the dragon and the Nation of Israel will be persecuted severely.

In the wilderness where the Israelites will flee, they will keep the commandments of God, but if they lose the love of Christ and do not bear fruit, men will cast them into the fire, to protect the nation of Israel and keep it Holy unto the Lord.

 John 15 is dealing with the nation of Israel and not an individual Christian.  This is NOT to say the Christian can’t learn from the passage of scripture many inspirational character traits that will shape his Christian standing. But doctrinally the passage doesn’t prove anything against Unconditional Eternal Security.

 

Kingdom of God – 1 Cor 6:9-10,  Gal 5:19-21,  Eph 5:3-5, Rev 21:8.

When asked about how many sins it takes for a Christian to lose his salvation, a conditional eternal securest answered “Hmmm... what about the example of Adam and Eve? How many sins did it take? I don?t think that anyone reading this needs to open their Bible to know how many sins it takes! “  Again you can see the evasive way this deceiver answered. Instead of just saying one sin, he beat around the bush and hinted at it. These people really are slippery slithering snakes! Anyway!

 Conditional eternal securist commonly known as ‘Insecurist’ believe that if a born again Christian commits a sin unto death ( 1 John 5:16) which they claim to be from the following verses 1 Corinthians 6:9-10   Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

 Galatians 5:19-21  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

 Ephesians 5:3-5  But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

 Revelation 21:8  But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 Conditional Securists say, that the Christian who commits only one time ANY of these sins in these lists, damns the circumcised soul, sealed, born again believer in Christ to Hell and he is now unsaved and kicked out the body of Christ ( 1 Cor 12:27, Rom 12:5,) until (or unless) he repents and confesses according to 1 John 1:9. he is hell bound all the way. The scriptures to prove this theory is NON EXISTANT. There is NO verse anywhere in scripture that says a saved Christian goes to Hell. There is no scripture to say that when a sinner becomes a Christian and hence a member of Christ body, that the Christian can ever be cut out Christ’s body. It says we are part of His flesh and bones ( Ephesians 5:30  For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. ) Devilish pride dictates to this sorts of people who cannot admit wrong! ‘Conditional’ Securists namely insecurists CANNOT see sense and read plain written English words in the KJV Bible. They have been blinded! The doctrine is propagated by means of trying to rubbish their opposing sides ( Unconditional Eternal Security ) argument by smoke screening and misquoting verses, hence their reasoning states that if I can shout loud enough and put so much disinformation about the subject, my doctrine must now be correct, WITHOUT PROVING one iota of it! This is the sign of the times with the many cults and ungodly teachers about. (no need to wonder who is whispering in Eve’s ear,  Gen 3:1,6 …  1 Tim 4:1).

Look at the ‘proof’ scripture verses (1 Cor 6:9-10,  Gal 5:19-21,  Eph 5:3-5, Rev 21:8) for saying that these sinning Christians will not go to heaven. Nowhere in the text does a person find the word ‘heaven’. These insecurists read ‘heaven’ into the text where it says “kingdom of God”. The kingdom of God is a spiritual kingdom which the believer has entered already ( John 3:5 … Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.) and he is in it right now (Romans 14:17  For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost. ). The believer will see it ( John 3:3 … Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.) in the millennium reign of Jesus Christ ( Rev 19:11-21) and if the Christian keeps his flesh in subjection ( 1 Cor 9:27) and works for the Lord Jesus, then the Christian will receive an inheritance in the kingdom of God if he is found worthy ( 2 Thes 1:5 … that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God,  …) of any reward.( Colossians 3:24  Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ.) They are bible perverts whose pride refuses themselves to read about the fornicator who DID NOT LOSE his salvation in  1 Corinthians 5:5  To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Demas is another example that they give for a saved man who loses his salvation. 2 Timothy 4:10  For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; Crescens to Galatia, Titus unto Dalmatia.

Their proof text says absolutely zilch about Demas losing his salvation or going to Hell! All it does say is that Demas forsook Paul.

Also they say Judas Iscariot was a saved man who went to hell (Act 1:25) True he went to hell (his own place) but Judas WASN’T saved in the first place, Judas NEVER claimed to believe, Judas was a thief ( John 12:6 ) Judas never called Jesus, ‘Lord’ but only master as a servant would do, Judas was never called a son as the other eleven were called ( John 15:15), in fact Judas wasn’t even a man (John 6:70-71  Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?  He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.)

 These conditional security people are propagating another gospel because they say a person isn’t saved unless he keeps himself righteous by not doing anything wrong according to the above references. I will quote them In the Bible there is initial salvation which is the moment a person puts his trust in Jesus Christ” and “However, there is also final salvation. This refers to entering the kingdom of God, which are only for those who meet the conditions of continuing in the faith.”  These people are nothing but pretending Jewish Pharisees. They look to the bible and when it says Israel, tribes, Hebrews, law keeping etc they say it is in the New Testament so it must apply to the Christian. Paul talks of blind Jewish leaders in the book of Romans, but it does aptly fit these charlatans  ( Romans 2:17-22  Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;  And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law. Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal? Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege? ) If anyone ever talks to these people, you will quickly find out that it is never the conditional security Pharisees that loses their salvation, it is always someone else, usually yourself if you ever question them.

 Conclusion, read your KJV1611 and put your trust in what it says.

 

“Every diversity in matters of interpretations among
saved people is caused by either adding something to the
verse, taking something from the verse or taking the verse
out of it’s context.” P.S.R.

 

 

Recommend reading

How to Lose salvation

38 Things Happen when we get saved

A Know So Salvation

Danger - Another Gospel

Heaven Bound

 

John Wycliffe 1320-1384

John Wycliffe 1320-1384

John 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

 

 

Home

Top Of Page

 

 

View      Guest Book      Sign